Redefining Success and Reclaiming Your Confidence Without Burn Out ft. Elyse Conroy
Listen on Apple Podcasts / Listen on Spotify
Burnout isn't just the result of working too many hours or pushing yourself to the limit—it's often rooted in perfectionism and trying to meet external expectations that don't align with who you really are. If you’ve ever found yourself chasing success, only to feel more stressed and drained than ever, you’re not alone.
In this blog, we’ll explore how redefining success and embracing imperfection can help you create a life and business that not only supports your success but also preserves your mental and emotional well-being. It’s time to stop the hustle and reframe what it means to truly thrive.
Why Redefining Success Matters
Success is often painted as something externally measurable—big titles, accolades, and financial achievements. But when we chase success based on societal standards or other people's expectations, we end up missing the mark on what actually makes us fulfilled.
When I spoke with confidence coach Elyse Conroy in a recent episode of the Burnout-Proof Podcast, she shared an essential truth: success needs to feel good to you, not just look good on paper.
Instead of pushing through burnout to reach a constantly moving finish line, it’s important to take a step back and ask yourself, What does success truly look like to me?
Maybe it’s freedom, maybe it’s flexibility, maybe it’s simply inner peace. Whatever it is, acknowledging it and shifting your mindset can be the first step in not just achieving success, but achieving it in a sustainable way.
The Trap of Perfectionism
One of the most harmful things we do to ourselves as high-achieving women is tie our self-worth to perfection. Perfectionism can look like:
Constantly striving for more—no matter how much you achieve, it’s never enough.
People-pleasing tendencies—you’re always saying yes and constantly worrying about how others perceive you.
Avoiding mistakes at all costs—failure becomes something to fear, rather than something to learn from.
The truth is, perfectionism is not a badge of honor—it’s a road to burnout. Elyse shared how, in her own journey, the moment she redefined success and started embracing imperfection was the moment she finally healed from burnout and began living with true confidence.
How to Redefine Success and Embrace Imperfection
Shift Your Definition of Success:
The first step is understanding that success is personal. For Elyse, it was no longer about a prestigious job title or being perfect in every area of life. Instead, success became about having time and freedom. Take a moment to ask yourself: What does success look like for me? Write it down. Maybe it’s working fewer hours, feeling at peace, or finally trusting yourself.Practice Imperfection:
Embracing imperfection isn’t about throwing in the towel and not caring about your work or results. It’s about accepting that not everything has to be perfect. Celebrate your wins, even the small ones, and forgive yourself when things don’t go as planned. Micro-moments of compassion, like taking a deep breath when you feel overwhelmed or taking a break when you need one, can keep you grounded and help you move forward.Focus on the Journey:
High achievers are often so fixated on the destination that they miss the beauty of the journey. As Elyse shared in the podcast, learning to enjoy the process rather than rushing to the result is essential for sustainable success. Start noticing and celebrating the small wins—did you make it through a difficult task today without stressing? Ding ding! Celebrate it. The more you focus on the little victories, the more confident you’ll become.Define Your Own Success Metrics (SPF Formula):
Elyse introduced her SPF formula: Success, Perfection, and Failure. This formula is a powerful tool to help you redefine success for yourself.Success: What truly defines it for you? It’s not just the material things, it’s how you feel.
Perfection: Let go of the belief that perfection is possible or necessary. Imperfect action is better than no action at all.
Failure: Redefine failure as feedback, not as a negative reflection of your worth. Every mistake is an opportunity to learn and grow.
The Bottom Line: Start Small
Building a life and business that aligns with your true success metrics doesn’t happen overnight. It’s about small, consistent changes—micro-moments that add up over time. You don’t have to take a year off like Elyse did, but you can start to incorporate these principles into your life, one small step at a time.
If you’re struggling with burnout or feeling like you’re always chasing something that doesn’t truly fulfill you, it’s time to redefine success and embrace imperfection. Shift your mindset and give yourself the space to thrive without burning out.
Take Action:
Reflect on what success truly means to you.
Start celebrating the small wins in your day.
Reframe failure as feedback, and let go of perfectionism.
Try to embrace the journey, not just the destination.
Resources & Links Mentioned in This Episode:
Elyse's website: SoulMakeUp.com
Elyse’s free resources: SoulMakeUp Free Resources
Elyse’s podcast: The Confidence Lounge
Ellyn’s Burnout-Proof Business resources: Burnout-Proof Business
About Elyse Conroy
Elyse Conroy is a Fortune 500 Beauty Industry executive turned Confidence Coach and Career Advocate, dedicated to helping high-achieving women build career confidence, elevate their leadership, and achieve executive success.
She works with powerhouse women to shatter self-imposed glass ceilings, silence perfectionism, and develop the bulletproof self-trust needed to take bold action—so they can unapologetically own every room, command respect, and lead with unshakable confidence.
Through her coaching, electrifying keynotes, The Confidence Lounge podcast, and transformational retreats, Elyse is on a mission to help women stop doubting themselves and step fully into the executive influence, presence, and success they were born for.
Follow Camille: @elyseconroyxo | Website | LinkedIn | PODCAST | The Confidence Lounge
Elyse’s free resources: SoulMakeUp Free Resources
Do you have anything to add?
Drop a comment below…
RELATED POSTS:
Ellyn Schinke (00:02.926)
Okay, compose yourself, Ellen. Elise, welcome to the show. I am so excited to have you here. Guys, prepare for energy. That's all I'm gonna say.
Yes, here we are. Hi. Hi. I'm so excited that I get to like, flip the script and interview you after you've interviewed me. I'm so excited for it because I love you and I think you're the coolest. I'm, I'm, I'm we're gonna go all over the place in this episode. But let's just start off with who is Elise? How did you get to be doing the work that you're doing? Give us a little bit of like a high level overview and then we'll dive into things.
Elyse (00:13.484)
just hit you, hit you from the jump. Here we are.
Elyse (00:22.436)
Thank
Elyse (00:27.098)
Likewise.
Elyse (00:40.762)
Alright, so my name is Elise Conroy and I am a confidence coach and career advocate for high achieving women, whether you're an entrepreneur or you're working in corporate America. So I never saw myself in this role, but I'm not surprised I ended up here. But my whole background is actually in the beauty industry. So it's like how does one go from being in the beauty industry, developing products, marketing products, to a confidence coach? So let's take this back to seven year old me when I used to seek refuge and ...
Ellyn Schinke (01:04.642)
We're throwing it back. shit.
Elyse (01:05.562)
Oh, we're going all, we're gonna go all the way back. So I used to seek refuge inside of my mom's makeup drawer when I was bullied as a kid and I loved these products so much. And I'm sitting here with pink sparkly backgrounds. My mom had a lipstick that looked like this and I truly believed, like sending so much love to seven year old me who believed that if I could make lipsticks that looked like this, that we could just solve all of women's confidence problems and make this world a more beautiful place. And I did that for almost 20 years.
But the reality is, is when they would wash my products off of their face, there goes their confidence and their self-esteem and their security right down the sink. So I really decided that my whole mission had never changed. I just wanted to do this intrinsically versus from the outside in because look, I was giving people a temporary solution and when I went on my own personal development journey and really found that there was this magical confidence formula that nobody out there had told me about, I don't know about you, I didn't have a confidence seizure, so.
Ellyn Schinke (01:57.112)
Fuck now.
Elyse (01:57.122)
I just went all in and decided that I wanted to start doing this work with women from the inside out and haven't looked back since.
Ellyn Schinke (02:04.03)
I love that. And I love that. I love the analogy that you used of their confidence went down the sink because it's really interesting. As you were saying that my brain went to, I feel like actually when you put me in front of other people, I'm very confident, but it's actually in the quiet moments where nobody else is around. That is where my confidence slips.
Elyse (02:09.54)
Yeah.
Elyse (02:16.708)
very confident. But it's actually in the quiet moment where nobody else
Elyse (02:24.282)
100%. I used to be the same way. would always look at my friends or coworkers as my security blanket. So I would be level 10 insecure, driving into a situation. But then once I was with my people, then everything was totally fine. And it was such a counterintuitive way to live because here I am with other people feeling okay, but then I couldn't even go to the grocery store by myself. And I'm like, hold on, this is a problem.
Ellyn Schinke (02:39.841)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (02:43.968)
Yeah. Yeah, it's like external validation seeking, but also I'm a words of affirmation person, which is why I always joke that I wish I wasn't a words of affirmation person because it like plays into that validation seeking that I always ran into. Okay, so I want to know what were some of the things that you said you went on this personal development journey.
Tell us a little bit about that. Like what did that look like? Cause I'm gonna assume it was, it's like the stereotypical picture you see of like success is never linear. It's like, like that. I'm gonna assume the personal development journey, especially from the lens of confidence was similar. Tell us a little bit about that journey.
Elyse (03:15.93)
So yeah, yeah, yeah.
Elyse (03:20.538)
Yes, very similar to that. And it was a trip because I used to think that it was just like a little staircase, right? Like I'd go up one stair and then I would feel that much more confident. But no, that is not how my journey looked. So I actually ended up leaving the beauty industry in 2018 because my dad was diagnosed with cancer. So I decided I was going to take a couple of months off and just really come back to who was I at this point of my life. And once I had taken that few months off, I just had this full body feeling of I am not ready to go back to work yet.
Ellyn Schinke (03:29.592)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (03:48.44)
and I thought I was gonna go back to beauty. I didn't have a plan to launch a business. And so I decided after reading a book that I was gonna go on a whim to Sri Lanka to go to this woman's retreat that this author was hosting. And I took a solo trip to Sri Lanka and I literally was now a couple months removed from corporate. I had no idea what the heck I was doing. And I really found a giant piece of myself and did this insane healing experience.
and I learned how to meditate, I learned about breath work, I learned how to be honest with myself for the first time, I learned how to not shame myself for how my body looks, and it was my first time of really ever going into healing burnout. I didn't realize how burned out I was, but it was sustained over almost 20 years, just compounded, and I just used to think, if I could just have a vacation or a nap, I'd be fine.
Ellyn Schinke (04:13.09)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (04:25.24)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (04:32.72)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Elyse (04:33.198)
And on that trip to Sri Lanka, was like, hold on, I actually think I might end up being off work for a little bit longer than I was originally imagining. Cause the first day was a couple months and then all of sudden it was like, okay, now I'm going to go to another retreat. So then I headed your way and went up to Washington for an executive leadership retreat, loved it, then went to another retreat. And so basically I took all of 2019 off to just come home to myself. And I had saved a lot of money in stocks from when I was working in corporate, I had sold those to fund my life and my business. And that was when I decided to go all in. But that year really helped me.
Ellyn Schinke (04:51.608)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (05:02.564)
to figure out who I was as an adult. Because think about it, it's like as adults, we don't get a year off to just say like, who am I? Let's do this. And I had to confront a lot of hard truths. I had to heal a lot of trauma. I had to heal a burnout. And it took me that whole year to finally feel like I could come up and catch my breath. And that is not what I expected. If you would have asked me that when I left corporate, I would have been like, no, it's a couple of weeks. I'll be totally fine. A year, didn't see that coming, but it was the best gift I've ever given myself.
Ellyn Schinke (05:09.101)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (05:29.528)
literally grabbing a piece of paper right now because there's so many, there's so many things I want to ask as a result of that story. So I'm going to try to I didn't write any of them down. I will in the future. But there's so many directions I want to take that I want to ask you about your burnout. I want to ask you about you know, for the people who can't take that year off. But I actually think the first thing I want to ask you because you touched on something that I know to be true, but I also don't think I talk about enough.
You said something along the lines of it was like a 20 year burnout.
Elyse (06:01.07)
Yeah. Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (06:03.086)
think that's really fucking important for us to talk about. So let's dive into that a little bit more, because I resonate with that as well. I do feel like the burnout I felt when it came to a head in my late 20s was 10, 15 years in the making. And I don't think that's an aspect of burnout we talk about enough. So tell me a little bit about how it built up for you, because I feel like this is very relatable.
Elyse (06:11.45)
Yeah.
Elyse (06:15.67)
in my late 20s was 10, 15 years in the making.
Elyse (06:25.902)
Yeah. I feel like this is very related. 100%. And I think it was micro moments and I didn't even see it coming. I had no idea it was happening. And I remember getting to this point where I looked at myself in the mirror and I was gray, I was over 200 pounds and I just thought about like, who are you? I never felt this low on confidence. I'd never felt this disconnected from myself, but I was doing everything right.
Ellyn Schinke (06:31.406)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (06:48.334)
I was checking every single box and here I am. Every dream in my life has come true and I'm grinding and I'm working 80 to $100 a week. So I'm flying 100,000 miles a year for my dream job. And I'm like, why is my dream job killing me? And I remember getting into that place of exhaustion where I couldn't even see myself clearly. did every answer to every question was, don't know. Who are you? I don't know. What do you enjoy at this point in your life? I don't know. What do you want to eat for lunch? I don't know. And I just felt so depleted. And I noticed around, I would say probably like the 10 year mark.
Ellyn Schinke (06:51.605)
you
Ellyn Schinke (06:58.894)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (07:16.718)
that I just couldn't catch up. And it was this constant feeling like I was always running behind. And even if I had a full week off, I didn't feel any more rested because I was grinding. And I just thought that I was doing it right. I was following the corporate model. was checking the corporate dream and the American dream that I thought I was supposed to do. And I remember my dad always instilling this work ethic into me to just keep going. If they needed more, then you give more and you don't stop. And I never stopped. So I would wake up in the middle of the night and check emails at 12 a.m.
Ellyn Schinke (07:29.037)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (07:38.35)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (07:46.146)
I would stay sometimes to the office at like 9, 10 p.m. and I'm like, why am I still here? I'm not even efficient at this point, but I wanted to seem like I was dedicated and I was committed and I wanted to get the gold star and the cookie and I was such a people pleaser and perfectionist that I was willing to get those kudos at any cost. But what I started to really lose myself in was this idea that I was doing it right and that if I wasn't performing, if I wasn't giving it my all, then I wasn't good enough.
and my identity was now wrapped up into my job and so was my self-worth and my confidence. So it was very confusing to arrive to that point where every box was checked, dreams had all come true, and I felt the worst I had ever felt in my life. And I think that seeing people at that point, they were carried out on stretchers and then they were celebrated because they were so committed. And I'm like, this is a problem, y'all. Like, this is not normal to be carried out on stress burnout like this. And I'm like, my God, that's gonna be me next. my God, hold on, I gotta get out of here. Like, is, something is wrong.
Ellyn Schinke (08:16.302)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (08:31.104)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (08:41.13)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. God, I resonate with that so much because I do feel like it's, it's the the box checking is something that I definitely did the like I should feel good about the direction I'm going and the path that I'm taking the things that I've accomplished. Why don't I? Like, I actually do feel I've always been good at like hobbies. But I also feel like, you know, if I'm really real with myself, I would question
how much sometimes I was doing my hobbies for me and how much I was doing them because I liked how the validation felt. I liked how the gold star felt. mean, don't get me wrong. People will always tell me soccer was Ellen's first love, especially the people that knew me when I was in college. Soccer was my first love. I absolutely loved playing soccer. I don't anymore because I'm broken. But like I loved playing soccer, but I also...
Elyse (09:19.066)
Yeah.
Elyse (09:31.098)
I don't anymore because I'm broke. But I loved playing soccer.
Ellyn Schinke (09:39.618)
struggled with soccer when I wasn't performing. I actually vividly remember, this is a funny tangent story. I was about to move to Michigan for grad school. It was my last game with my intramural team. And I'd spent the entire day at the river with the guy I was dating at the time and his friends. And I made the epic mistake of trying to keep up with, AKA out drink this girl that
Elyse (09:43.186)
I vividly remember, oh this is a funny tangent story. I was...
My last game was my intramural team. And I spent the entire day at the river with the guy I was dating at the time and his friends. And I made the epic mistake of trying to keep up with, AKA out drink this girl that we were hanging out with, who apparently can drink most of the men in their friend group under the table. Oh dear. I was trying to keep up with her, College H Ellen, and I got very drunk that day. He had to drive my car home, and by the time we got to the intramural soccer game,
Ellyn Schinke (10:05.602)
we were hanging out with who apparently can drink most of the like men in their friend group under the table. I didn't know this, but I was trying to keep up with her. College aged Ellen and I got very drunk that day. He had to drive my car home and by the time we got to the intramural soccer game that night, I was still a little drunk. And so I played like shit and it was last game with my intramural team and I remember being so angry at myself and at how that game went. I literally had to walk laps.
Elyse (10:22.22)
God.
Ellyn Schinke (10:35.126)
around the soccer field. was just walking around the soccer field trying to calm down. Fortunately, the guy that I was dating at the time, he played semi pro hockey and he was just like, just let her go. Just just let her cool down. Like he got it. But it's like those moments where the things that are supposed to bring you joy are actually become tools that you judge yourself for. So it's like I question how much of that was actually purely out of enjoyment and how much of that was
Elyse (10:53.237)
100 % question how much of that was actually Yeah, and I wonder about that, but I digress
Ellyn Schinke (11:00.302)
for gold stars and that I was good at it and how like how people reacted to I was a good soccer player. Like I wasn't like fucking D1 level soccer player, but I was a good soccer player. And I wonder about that, but I digress. digress. yeah, I feel like everything you're saying I relate to whether it was soccer or academics or the career path I was going down. It was it was micro moments and it was like this accumulation of my identity getting very, very wrapped up in.
Elyse (11:21.754)
going down, it was micro moments and it was like this accumulation of my identity getting very, very wrapped up in these things. Whether it was Ellen as a soccer player or Ellen as a scientist, my identity got very, very wrapped up in these things. So tell me how for you did that culminate in burnout and what did your experience with burnout feel like? Because this is the thing I love about burnout is it can be very different. It can show up very differently depending upon the person we're talking about in the situation.
Ellyn Schinke (11:29.998)
these things, whether it was Ellen as a soccer player or Ellen as a scientist, my identity got very, very wrapped up in these things. So tell me how for you did that culminate in burnout and what did your experience with burnout feel like? Because this is the thing I love about burnout is it can be very different. It can show up very differently depending upon the person we're talking about in the situation there.
Elyse (11:48.866)
Yeah, for me, it was all linked back to perfection, people, pleasing anti-achievement, right? Because if I wasn't winning, I was losing. If it like there was no such thing as good enough is good enough. It always had to be perfect at any cost, right? And I would strive for perfection. But then I would get to that point. Like I remember getting employee of the year. I got a $25,000 raise. I developed a product that went in every door target.
Ellyn Schinke (11:54.478)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (12:11.834)
And literally, I remember holding my trophy and I was like, I should have gotten $30,000 or $50,000, whatever it was. So I would always move the bar. So even when I did achieve, it still wasn't good enough in my own standards. So I was my own worst enemy that was then, it was like the self sacrifice where I would beat myself up. I would kill myself just in this spiral of trying to do more. But once again, all I'm doing at that point is wasting time and energy. I wasn't actually moving the bar or doing anything better. And so for me, it got to this point where
Ellyn Schinke (12:17.774)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (12:21.23)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (12:33.932)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Elyse (12:38.85)
I started noticing, I would second guess everything. And then I started doing that to my teams at work. And it was this constant like, hold on, it's gotta be better, right? And then I'm projecting that perfection upon to everybody else. And I would get so tied up in, if we did lose now, I'm a terrible person and I would make it mean horrible things about ourselves. And then I wouldn't ask for help because then I had to do everything, right? I was carrying the world on my shoulders. So I would isolate myself and I felt...
Ellyn Schinke (12:48.706)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (13:01.122)
Yeah.
Elyse (13:02.848)
angry at the world because then I wasn't connecting, right? It's like I'm putting myself on this island and then mad that I didn't have everyone there with me, but yet I didn't invite them to the party. So I felt a lot of shame, you know, for not having it all together, for not being perfect. And I would get stuck in these self-critical thoughts that would just annihilate me and it would isolate me further. And then I would forget how capable I was and I would lose sight of the whole mission to begin with, right? And when I actually stepped away and did that gap year, it was like,
Ellyn Schinke (13:13.518)
Yeah.
Elyse (13:29.732)
Hold on, what was this all even for? And I started doing something that I know for a lot of perfectionists is like, they can't even fathom this idea. But someone told me, they were like, you know what, Elise, good enough is good enough. And I was like, you're wrong. And I remember defending that to the death. And I was like, no. I was so mad when they said that, because I'm like, that's an admission of failure. And they're like, aren't you already failing if you're living this way? And I was like, whoa, OK, you just punched me in the face with that, Diddy. Thank you. But it was that truth bomb that was like, wait.
Ellyn Schinke (13:43.575)
You are wrong.
Elyse (13:59.054)
Hold on, and it rattled me and I couldn't unhear what they had just asked me and it kept bringing me back to this place of what if good enough is actually good enough? What is perfection is just an illusion? What if failure is actually a success metric and it's inevitable? And it reframed my whole entire perspective on life. And when I started thinking about like those moments where I did start to catch my breath, it was because I wasn't beating myself up 24 seven. And I was like, wow, I actually feel like I'm finally healing from this burnout because I'm no longer self inducing it.
Ellyn Schinke (14:29.03)
This is why for all of the people who say like I've actually had a client outright tell me this compassion breeds complacency. That was her concern about being self compassionate is she thought it would lead to complacency. And actually, I always whenever people say that now I challenge it because I feel like I'm pretty damn self compassionate. Do I still have perfectionism? Do I still have people pleasing? Absolutely. That shit gets its claws on you and it's hard to get completely away from it. But
Elyse (14:42.851)
and actually.
Yeah.
Elyse (14:53.294)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (14:56.974)
actually do feel like the compassion is there now because I'm able to kind of step into my more rational brain and talk myself off the ledge more. But like for people who say compassion breeds complacency, I would like literally re listen to that what she just said that whole kind of story she told about how she treated herself because like, Elise, you were essentially framing why compassion actually doesn't breed complacency. And the fact of the matter is criticism.
Elyse (15:23.226)
criticism, self-sabotage, all of these things that you were saying and doing to yourself, those were actually probably creating more complacency than a passion ever would. Because it sends you into this place where you don't trust yourself, you don't believe in yourself, and that is, especially for a high achieving woman, like probably more demotivating than any other. 100%. And if you think about it, this is why perfectionists and high achievers are wired to burn out.
Ellyn Schinke (15:24.0)
self-sabotage, all of these things that you were saying and doing to yourself, those were actually probably creating more complacency than compassion ever would because it sends you into this place where you don't trust yourself, you don't believe in yourself. And that is, especially for a high achieving woman, like probably more demotivating than anything else.
Elyse (15:51.214)
because there is no amount of enoughness. There is, we always are changing the metrics. And I think about for me when I was moving the bar or when I was beating myself up, to me that used to be a metric of how much I cared. So if I was beating myself up harder for it to show the world that look, I made a mistake, look how hard I am being on myself, like this was supposed to mean something, but it didn't. It was just burning me out further. And I remember somebody had said something similar to me as the complacency and compassion comment to you.
Ellyn Schinke (15:51.373)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (16:10.84)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (16:18.52)
and they said that you need to learn how to accept. And I was like, no, by accepting, then that means I'll always stay here. And they're like, no, by accepting, you actually get to be here. And I was like, what? I don't understand that. And I remember reading something at that point where it said stress comes from focusing on where you're not. And I was like, my God, so if I just accept where I am and accept, okay, this is the moment, right? Like I think about when I was shaming my body, right? Like, okay, well, this is how my body looks today. How can I love it today?
right? Or, this is where my business is at today. How can I love it today and then still want to do better? Like I'm still always going to have the desire for incredible achievements, but by accepting where I am versus resisting it, my God, talk about burnout cure in one sentence. That is part of it. Because think about going up a river and you're paddling and you're paddling up current versus just like being in the flow and you're enjoying the ride and you're still going to get to your destination. It's just going to be a very different process and you're going to arrive much more energized and confident.
Ellyn Schinke (16:53.196)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (17:01.144)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (17:06.862)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (17:13.932)
Yes, yes, a lot less exhausted. That was actually something when you were speaking before, you talked about how your dad instilled in you this work ethic and how how that kind of informed how you worked before. And I literally wrote down, does life now mean not having a work ethic? And I feel like you answered that question is that you still achieve, you still go do the damn thing. But the process of achievement looks so much different than it did before.
Elyse (17:43.874)
It does, and it feels so different. And I am able to achieve so much more success with this mindset than when I was pushing myself, when I was hustling, when I was beating myself up and shaming myself and always striving for more. Now I'm doing remarkable things every single day. That has never changed. I'm always gonna be a high achiever. That's just who I am, right? But I also don't shame myself in the moments where things might be going wrong or where things don't look as I thought they were going to look because ...
Ellyn Schinke (17:45.88)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (18:02.306)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (18:10.626)
A lot of things in my life, like I always get what I want. I just define myself as that type of woman, right? But the way that I get to getting what I want, it doesn't always look like how I imagined it to. And before I would make that such a problem. And now that's just an inevitable part of the journey. So I don't need to war against it and it doesn't burn me out. So I'm just on the journey and I'm like, cool, we're still gonna get there. It might take me a little bit longer. It might feel a little bit different. I might need different support tools to get me there, but I just don't, I don't.
Ellyn Schinke (18:28.28)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (18:35.512)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (18:37.762)
The whole experience of achievement feels totally different. And ironically, I've created so much more success. if you would have told me this 10 years ago, when I was living in that space of really being fully committed to perfectionism at all costs, right? I would have been like, no, you can't get there unless you're perfect. And I just send so much love to myself that really believes that that was the vehicle towards actually getting what I
Ellyn Schinke (18:51.362)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (18:54.988)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (19:00.11)
Mm hmm. it's so it's I'm actually really, really glad selfishly that we're having this conversation today because I actually feel like and this is this is transparency moment. I think you'll probably agree with this as well. These impulses that we have these like, it has to look a certain way. I feel like they're still there.
always the per like I said before the perfectionism the people pleasing even the this is what success looks like it's still there it's still in the back of our head because so much of what we're teaching ourselves and moving ourselves away from is literally like cultural societal how we were raised like those things are foundational for a lot of us but we're learning how to do it differently and I want to give the example of recently I've had some ahas of some pivots I want to make in my business and you know what my first thought was
I literally had to chat GPT-therapize my way through this thought process. My first thought was, Ellen, you're being flaky and you're just procrastinating on the things that you said you wanted. And I had to really sit with that and literally have go back and forth and use chat GPT as a sounding board. Trust me, I would do therapy, but it's fucking expensive and I just can't afford it right now. But like I had to sit there with chat GPT and really.
Elyse (19:47.886)
Bye.
Elyse (19:57.72)
And I had to really sit with that and literally have to go back and forth and use Jetty PT.
Ellyn Schinke (20:10.508)
That was my first thought. I think there's, I love when people say like, your first thought is like the conditioned thought. Your second thought is the actual thought. My first thought was you're procrastinating and you're being flaky and you're not following through. My second thought was, is this being flaky and procrastinating or is this actually just a pivot? A pivot that feels more aligned.
Elyse (20:10.712)
That was my first thought. I think there's, I love when people say like, your first thought is like the conditioned thought. Your second thought is the actual thought. My first thought was you're procrastinating and you're being flaky and you're not following through. My second thought was, is this being flaky and procrastinating or is this actually just a pivot? A pivot that feels more aligned. Like the fact of the matter was, and it actually came out of the shit show that was last week. Guys, we were supposed to record this a week ago, but Ellen had a day.
Ellyn Schinke (20:31.02)
Like the fact of the matter was and it actually came out of the shit show that was last week, guys, we were supposed to record this a week ago, but Ellen had a day and we rescheduled. Fully transparent. I had a day and Elise was kind enough to let us reschedule.
Elyse (20:44.653)
But wait, let's pause on that for a second because if you wouldn't have paused in that, what would have happened? You would have gotten more burned out, right? It wouldn't have been an effective moment. So I love that you did that. I think that was such a beautiful permission.
Ellyn Schinke (20:51.17)
I would have gotten more burned out. Yeah, yeah. I was so looking forward to talking to you too. And I was in a place where I was just like, I'm not gonna enjoy this conversation. I'm not gonna be fully present in this conversation. I'm not gonna be able to ask you the things I wanted to ask you about and have the conversation I wanted to have with you. Like everything about this is gonna be a shit show if I go through with it. So I'm so glad we rescheduled.
Elyse (21:15.236)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (21:18.594)
But yeah, it came out of last week of me realizing, you know what? Maybe my business doesn't look like I thought it would look. Maybe I actually, one of my core values is freedom and I don't like having a lot of shit on my calendar. I hate it in fact. It makes me feel trapped. Even if that's making me a lot of money, even if it outwardly looks really good, that's maybe not the kind of business I wanna run. Maybe I wanna sell more digital products and it might not be the sexiest way to do business, but it actually feels really good.
Elyse (21:25.636)
Maybe.
Elyse (21:40.345)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (21:48.192)
I'm a nerd and you give me eight hours, I'm gonna go on Notion or on my latest system that I'm loving using and I'm gonna nerd out and build shit for eight hours. That is fun to me and I know it's not fun to a lot of people. And that was the aha that I had last week and I immediately questioned it because it isn't what you see on Instagram. It's like the sexy business that somebody's building. And so that was my like high achiever, my conditioning coming up.
And then there was the part of me that's actually done the work in the background going, okay, I get that you feel that way. But let's check that thought process for just a second. Maybe this is just a pivot. And maybe this is actually what you wanted all along. But maybe you were a little too scared to go for it.
Elyse (22:19.898)
I get that you feel that way, but let's check that thought process. Maybe this is just a pivot and maybe this is actually what you wanted all along, but maybe you were a little too scared to go. Yeah. It's funny because as you were saying that, I was like, I think it was just fear, right? It's like just noticing that it's just protection. And it's funny because one of the first formulas I ever developed when I started my business and really just went all in on figuring this stuff out.
Ellyn Schinke (22:33.998)
think it was. Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (22:42.872)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (22:43.692)
is a formula I called SPF. And it's like my old beauty roots die so hard. I can't get away from all of these beauty references, but.
Ellyn Schinke (22:46.552)
Hey.
Honestly, I love this pivot too because I wrote down support tools and that's where I wanted to go with you next. So yeah, let's do it.
Elyse (22:54.102)
Yes, so SPF stands for success, perfection, and failure. And everybody has a different metric for these three things. And what's so interesting is when I think about where I was at when I was in corporate, that really this whole identity of what success meant to me, and this is what burned me out, was having lots of money, having a title, flying first class, living in a certain zip code, having this husband, driving this car, having Chanel in my closet, whatever it might be, right? Then I got all those things and I still wasn't happy. So when I had that gap year, I was like, okay.
If I were to redefine what success meant for me at this point in my life, what is that? And it was having time and it was having freedom. And those were the two things that I based my whole entire foundation of my business upon. And I was like, okay, if we were to do that with failure, what is my definition of failure? Because before it would be not having all those things. And now I didn't give a shit about those things anymore, right? Those didn't define me because I was so much more than my material things or my success or my status. And so when I actually sat down and wrote, is failure? And I said, giving up on myself.
And I was like, ooh, ooh, okay, that's very different than what the traditional failure model looked like. And I was like, okay, so then what is perfect? What is perfect at this point in my life? And I was like, you know what, to me, at this point, being perfect is an imperfectly, like giving myself permission to be an imperfect human. That feels perfect to me because I know I'm gonna make a mess. I know that human experience is ugly and it is dark and I'm gonna make a lot of mistakes and I'm gonna fall flat on my face. But when I looked at the different definitions, I don't think that I had ever truly defined
what success, perfection, and failure meant for me. I had just taken society's model and the conditioning that we were handed and used that as my metric. But when I actually sat down and said, okay, here's the definition of each, and then gave myself permission for that to change and evolve, right? And then saying, here's how know I'm gonna achieve each, and then what am I gonna do when I fail? I'm not gonna make it mean anything negative about me. I'm just gonna use it as feedback that's gonna inform my next best success, right? And that whole SPF model, I love offering this to women because for so many of us,
Ellyn Schinke (24:34.584)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (24:45.038)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (24:50.276)
We don't have it defined, you know, it's like having an address in our GPS. We're just driving, driving, driving, and we hope that we get to where we want to go, but we're not intentional about what we want the journey to look like and how we want to feel along the way and how we know we get there, right? So we can actually sit down and put these metrics down. Now we're actually talking. Now we're having a real conversation. Now you're in control over where you're going every single day. And I think it all starts with getting honest with yourself about what those three things look like.
Ellyn Schinke (25:07.49)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (25:15.626)
I that I've heard the defined success before, but I've never heard the design define perfection and failure. can't I feel like there's 80,000 questions I could ask you from what you've got. Damn, I need to have back again. But like, I think the one I want to ask the most right now is I'm a stereotypical Enneagram three, I get very focused on the results.
Elyse (25:24.346)
I feel like there's 80,000.
Ellyn Schinke (25:42.902)
and not the journey and the process of getting to the results. It seems like you've gotten to a place where you're able to enjoy the process more. What would you say to somebody like me who does struggle with that? I can get into a mode where I enjoy the process. I will fully cop to the fact that it probably depends on my time of the month. But what would you say to somebody like that?
Elyse (25:44.506)
Yeah. Yeah. It seems like you've gotten to a place where you're able.
Elyse (25:57.572)
can get into a mode where I enjoy.
Elyse (26:04.814)
Yeah.
Elyse (26:08.642)
Yeah, you've got to be in the micro moments and you've got to celebrate every teeny teeny little win. The stuff that your brain says, that's insignificant, right? And I think about it like if you were eating a meal and so many of us are so focused on just getting through the meal that we're not actually savoring every single bite that made the meal so delicious. So when you're swishing that food around in your mouth and you're like, my God, this is so delicious, you're going to lose sight of how much is still left on your plate because you're so in the experience of enjoying your food, right?
Ellyn Schinke (26:31.598)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (26:35.214)
So I think the same goes with anything that you're doing in your life. Like for example, right now we're planning a trip to Mexico. I am not focused on going to Mexico. I am focused on the buildup and I'm packing and I'm planning all my outfits and I'm looking at all these pictures. Yeah, and I'm talking to my husband about like, what do we want this experience to be? And I'm telling my teaching my son Spanish, right? And it's so fun because the vacation started before the vacation even started. So now we're gonna go on this trip.
Ellyn Schinke (26:46.862)
That's a really good example.
Ellyn Schinke (26:59.286)
That's a really good example.
Elyse (27:01.25)
Yeah, and we're going to have this incredible experience, but it's not just about getting to Mexico. It's about the buildup and what you make it mean and how you incorporate that into your daily life. So I think when you can look at life as those micro little things that you're doing every single day and you can be hyper present in that, it takes the pressure off of getting to the end destination because you're so lost in the beauty of the journey that the end destination starts to become irrelevant and it destigmatizes what it means to actually get there.
Ellyn Schinke (27:10.562)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (27:17.474)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (27:23.31)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (27:28.704)
Yeah, the funny thing is I'm literally going to Hawaii on Saturday as we record this. I have a pile of stuff on the other side of my coffee table where I'm kind of collecting the stuff I want to bring with me and I've been doing that. So I love that that serving as an example of how we can do that in the rest of our lives. And actually the thought I had as you were explaining that is the notion of romanticizing.
Elyse (27:31.982)
Right? Yes.
Elyse (27:40.334)
Yeah.
Elyse (27:50.702)
Yes, yes, yes.
Ellyn Schinke (27:51.086)
Your life like when I do something that made me absolutely love doing something that I do every week My weekly review is the fact that I romanticize it some mornings I will take myself on a saturday morning date where i'll go to a coffee shop get myself like buy myself breakfast buy myself a coffee and then I do my my weekly review over that sometimes I do a glass of wine and I light a candle but even like some of the changes i've been making to my environment I live in 500 square feet and most people would scoff at that. I love
Elyse (28:10.692)
Yeah.
Elyse (28:18.894)
Yeah. I love it.
Ellyn Schinke (28:20.46)
my space. I've been like engineering my space. I've been by by fake flowers. have like fake plants on either side of my desk. I have this bulletin board that I just hung up last night. You can actually see those are peel and stick tiles that I hung in my kitchen right there. Like I'm romanticizing my environment even though I'm renting even though like there's all of these things that I can qualify as reasons why I'm not there yet. I'm not perfect yet. But I'm romanticizing the experience of getting there.
Elyse (28:48.314)
Yeah. Yes.
Ellyn Schinke (28:49.868)
And it's the shit that I do think a lot of times gets tagged as frivolous. Like, is it it frivolous to buy a fake plant for my desk or to buy spend 100 bucks on peel and stick tiles for my kitchen and my bathroom? Maybe to some people it is but I actually feel like for me, it allows me to enjoy and romanticize the stage of life that I'm in and I think otherwise I wouldn't do that.
Elyse (29:13.804)
rights. And why wouldn't you want to be in love with your life? And I think that's where I had so much defeat and so much burnout come in before I started really working on myself is I would only focus on the finish line. So for example, when I started dating my husband, when are we getting married? When are we getting married? When are we getting married? When? And just he's like, my God, I'm not going to marry you if you keep asking me when we're going to get married, right? He's like, literally calm down. And I'm like, is this happening? Is it going? Like I couldn't be okay.
Ellyn Schinke (29:16.28)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (29:21.986)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (29:40.078)
just dating him and he's taking me on all these extravagant trips and I'm like, are you gonna propose on this trip? Are you gonna propose on this trip? my God, like I could go back and slap myself. So annoying. And it was the same way with work. When am I getting my dream job at SA Lauder? Is it gonna happen? Is it gonna happen? And then going through the interview process, I remember just, I had to get to the yes. It was only good enough if I could get to the yes. And I didn't enjoy the process. I didn't enjoy the journey because I was so focused on the end destination and it took me so out of being present because I was so lost in.
Okay, don't make this mistake from the past. And then is this going to happen in the future that I was not in the now of my life? And that was a big thing that I learned how to shift when I started working with a healer in 2017. And she's like, you are so checked out. You're like in a spaceship floating off somewhere, just worried about perfection and achievement. Like you need to get in your life and you need to be in love with your life. And it's like old habits die hard. Cause when I started my business, I would, you know, I'd have a win. I'd sign a client. do a great training, whatever it might be. And then I'd sit here and I'm like defeated.
Ellyn Schinke (30:13.891)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (30:36.802)
And I, because I was so focused on how I thought I was going to feel after that achievement. And then I didn't feel that way. And I was like, right, I know, but we all do this, especially as high achievers. Right. And so I'm like, what are you waiting for to actually celebrate yourself? Like, were you celebrating the fact that you put together a 45 page deck to present to people? No, you, you literally were like, I got to get to the workshop, you know? And so I was like, okay, you're going to start being your biggest cheerleader and you're going to start.
Ellyn Schinke (30:41.71)
I'm so called out. Stop calling me out. Yeah.
Elyse (31:01.198)
doing these things to celebrate yourself. Because I think at some point I was just waiting when I started my business, waiting for like a marching band and cheerleaders to come in and be like, Elise, you did a good job. And I was like, where are you doing that in your own life? So my client actually bought me a celebration bell. I called it ding ding. No surprise here it is branded in hot pink sparkles, right? She owns a branding agency. And I ring my bell for myself all the time. I'm like, whoa, I drank eight glasses of water today. Ding ding, right?
didn't have a meltdown in the car when I was stressing about my launch. Ding, ding. I didn't have a meltdown about my toddler telling me to F off, you know? But this actually activates in your nervous system that you are safe to celebrate and that you actually had an achievement that was worthy of celebration. But if you're not doing that for yourself, of course, you're only going to be focused on the end destination. This is why the micro steps and the micro moments start to stack. And that's where confidence is truly built is in those spaces where you give yourself permission to celebrate it.
Ellyn Schinke (31:30.959)
my God, I need that.
Ellyn Schinke (31:53.23)
love that too because my brain immediately went to like think about how in today's day and age we think of the pings and the dings and the shit that's happening around us. Usually that means notification. Usually that means somebody needs something from me. Usually that means stress and triggering your stress cycle. I actually love that because I feel like that almost takes back the pinging noise to mean something good.
Elyse (31:58.298)
day's day and age, we think of the kings of the day.
Elyse (32:04.472)
Yep. Stress. Yeah.
Elyse (32:14.478)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, and my clients love this bell. Let me tell you, when they get a dang, dang ring, they're like, I did something really good. And it could be the smallest thing. Like I looked in the mirror today and I didn't shit on myself or I didn't look at my cellulite and my wrinkles over my beautiful eyes, whatever it is, you know, it's these little micro moments that then all of a sudden you're like, oh, okay. And this is where we start to come back to life. This is where we start to come back to ourselves. And I think these were the type of things that on the heels of that year long, you
Ellyn Schinke (32:41.464)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (32:47.224)
gap year where I came back to life as a person, it was those little things. And I didn't give myself a date. I didn't give myself an end destination. It was just about the journey. I went on 15 trips that year. And it was all, every time I got on that plane, I didn't know who was going to be born. I didn't know what parts of me were gonna come alive. It was like Pandora's box opening. But I just gave myself permission to be on the journey and not have any expectations or parameters.
Ellyn Schinke (32:48.472)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (32:51.96)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (32:57.304)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (33:06.764)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (33:11.872)
Yeah, yeah. It's like, what if we embrace the uncertainty instead of feared it? Because there is a form of stress that is called uncertainty stress and it is very pervasive and hard for a lot of people to navigate. But yeah, it's like a what if we purely just embrace the uncertainty instead of feared it or ran from it? I want to talk about the year though that you took because ever since you said that, honestly, it very much reminds me of my remote year experience, though I will say
Elyse (33:17.486)
Yes.
Yeah.
Elyse (33:31.716)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (33:41.342)
My remote year experience for me was more of an escape than a learning moment. I feel like the learnings came later because I was so close to the version of myself that dropped out of grad school because of burnout. I was so close to that that I don't feel like it was as intentional of a transformational experience. But naturally, most of the people listening to this probably don't have the ability to take the year.
Elyse (33:55.392)
Yeah
Ellyn Schinke (34:10.55)
So for those people, you talk about the micro moments so much, what are ways in which they can build these like micro moments of healing, these little things, like how could they take what you experienced in that year and kind of pepper it into their lives in a way that feels more sustainable for them?
Elyse (34:25.37)
into their lives in the way that we listen to things? I love this question because if you think about what we do for our cars, right, it's like most of us have vehicles who are listening, we go to a gas station and we take five minutes to put fuel in it or if we have an electric car we plug it in every single night. We do this with our devices every single day but yet we don't take that time to do it for ourselves. We're so lost in the monotony of what life is, we're so just on the grind just doing the things.
And I think that we lose sight of pouring back into ourselves. And as cheesy as it sounds, like we really could not get from an empty cup. And I think about now where I'm at in my life, I don't need a lot of time in the way that I used to, to refill myself. But in that year, I had to learn. I never put self care first. That to me was like, that's a luxury that's only available to some people who have time. No, I didn't know that that was actually something I was actively going to have to create time for. Because if we're trying to find the time, we're never gonna find it, right? So I had to learn how to restructure my life and my lifestyle.
Ellyn Schinke (35:06.083)
down.
Elyse (35:21.518)
to actually pour back into myself. So I would spend time in the morning meditating. If I felt like my brain was racing, I would do a thought dump. If I felt a lot of energy moving through my body, I would go dance or do movement. If I felt like I needed to ground, I would garden or I would go on a hike. And all of those little types of things were medicine. And I didn't realize that that's what I was doing at the time. But all of those things were basically me going to the fuel station.
refueling myself to heal that burnout and bring myself back to life. And I almost picture my transformation like a wilting flower, right? Like I was so wilted. I was just, I was on the verge of death. I was unrecognizable. If I were to show you a picture of me from 2017, 2018, you would not know it was me. And in doing that, I ended up blossoming, right? I lost 55 pounds. My color came back into my skin. My twinkle came back into my eye.
had this sense of aliveness that was magnetic and it just started magnetizing people towards me. I started instead of saying, don't know, I did have the answers because I was deciding. Before I was so decision fatigued and so analysis paralysis out that I could not make a decision to save my life because it felt so overwhelming, but my capacity started opening up again. So for anybody who's listening that's like, it must be nice. She had a gap year. Well, could you have a gap day where you do a quarter day social media detox and instead of just scrolling Instagram and tuning out, you tune in.
Could you go on a hike and push your body? Because I know those first hikes that I did, that was such a metaphor for where I was at in life because all my brain wanted to do was talk me out of it. You can't do this. You're going to die. Why are you so out of breath? Oh my god, you're a piece of shit. How did you let it get to this point? And every day, I would just keep showing up to that trail. And I'd be like, OK, I'm going to overcome something. And I don't know what the journey is. Yeah. Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (36:43.566)
Preach.
Ellyn Schinke (36:53.26)
Mm-hmm.
I'm gonna actually swoop in on that point because I had the exact same experience on remote year in 2018. I did a shit ton of hiking and I remember we did a trek to Machu Picchu. We didn't take the train in. We trekked into Machu Picchu. It was four days, three nights. And there was a day we got to the highest point of our trek. was like just under Everest Base Camp altitude. So we were at a high altitude, I think, if I'm remembering correctly. And I remember I was like counting
Elyse (37:01.24)
Yeah. did a shit ton of hiking and I remember we did a trek to Machu Picchu. We trekked into Machu Picchu. It was four days, three nights and there.
Elyse (37:17.465)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (37:25.772)
I needed to take 20 steps. And I remember as I was getting close to the top, I kept saying to myself, you can do hard things. You can do hard things. You can do hard things. And that actually became my mantra for that year and why hiking became such a metaphor for me, because it literally is you just have to put one step in front of the other. You can do hard things. Is it going to suck? Yes. But that view from the top is going to be so fucking worth
Elyse (37:27.834)
Yeah.
Elyse (37:38.394)
It's so worth it. that, yes, that you can do hard things. That literally my coaching program name for five years was the CAN program, right? Because CAN was an acronym for Confident Action Now. And I remember hiking was what brought me to that realization that, you know what, I could push past my edge.
Ellyn Schinke (37:55.97)
Really?
Ellyn Schinke (38:03.47)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (38:03.502)
and I can overcome this talk that's in my brain. And when I looked up at how much of the trail was left, then I would start trying to talk myself out of it. But when I focused on watching my feet, just one, my God, you did another one, my God, you did another one, and before you knew it, I was at the top. And then I would get this flood of confidence and just so much celebratory energy through my body because I actually talked myself into it versus talking myself out of it, right? And that is one of the biggest skills you can ever learn.
Ellyn Schinke (38:26.221)
Mm-hmm.
Elyse (38:31.158)
is for the metaphorical purpose of going up the mountain, right? Of learning how to have that relationship with yourself and making peace with the unknown and making peace with that inner critic who's gonna tell you that you can't get to the top and tell you how many other times that you failed. When you can overcome that version of yourself, my God. And it doesn't take a long time, right? And that's why I keep saying, like, you don't need a year like what I did. Like, yes, I had the luxury of doing that, but that also wasn't a coincidence. I set myself up for that. So if you wanna take a gap year, go save whatever money you need to save.
Ellyn Schinke (38:37.388)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (38:51.02)
Yeah
again.
Elyse (38:58.626)
or if it's a gap month and you wanna go on a backpacking trip through Europe. Like I think solo travel and pushing yourself to the edge is one of the biggest ways to grow quickly and that's what I always challenge my clients to, especially on the other side of getting fired or a breakup or a burnout, go take a solo trip. You will heal in ways you could have never imagined, but you're gonna go through hard things. But it's because of those hard things that you will become your best version of yourself and your strongest and most confident version of yourself. Confidence is related to discomfort.
Ellyn Schinke (39:04.142)
Elyse (39:28.302)
I always say the way to confidence is high levels of self-belief, self-trust, and your ability to take action while feeling uncomfortable. And people don't like that. They're like, I just want to feel confident. It's like trying to go to get to marriage without going through the messiness of the dating process. You have to go through the shit. You have to go through that discomfort before you can get to the cozy Netflix and chill on the couch moment. So I always encourage people, do the hard thing, because you can.
Ellyn Schinke (39:52.546)
I love it. I love it so much. would you say are your, if we had to kind of give them some of those micro steps that they could take, micro moments that they could take, what would you say are your favorite confidence building activities? I know you mentioned meditation way back when that you got into meditation. I'm a big fan of spending time in silence, even if you don't call it meditation. I think it is very powerful for high achievers to spend time in silence. Your intuition is going to start speaking louder when you spend time in silence. You're going to start to realize that you don't have to
Elyse (39:56.314)
We had to kind of give.
they could take micro moments that they could take. What would you say are your favorite confidence building activities? know you know, you mentioned meditation. Yeah, when you got into meditation. I'm a big fan of spending time in silence, even if you call it meditation. think it is very powerful for high achievers to spend time in silence, your intuition is going to start speaking louder when you spend time in silence, you're going to start to realize that you don't have to fucking listen to every thought that you have. I think it's a powerful tool. So what would you say are some of your like,
Ellyn Schinke (40:21.336)
fucking listen to every thought that you have when you spend time in silence. I think it's a powerful tool. So what would you say are some of your like micro tools that you highly recommend to high achieving women?
Elyse (40:30.058)
you highly recommend? Yeah. High achieving women. I think things that bring you back to yourself. For me, that gap year, a big part of our trips was camping. And that's what I did as a kid. And being outdoors, and once again, the hiking component, being next to the ocean for me was so important. So we would go beach camping all the time. And it just brought me back to myself in ways that I didn't even realize I knew I needed. Because what I would always say before is people would ask me, like, what are your hobbies? I'm like,
Ellyn Schinke (40:39.912)
Ellyn Schinke (40:45.261)
Ugh.
Elyse (40:56.472)
time for hobbies. Do you see my career? That is my life, right? But I had to actually do things. Yeah, and they laugh it off and I'm like, no wonder why you're burned out and miserable and resentful at the world. And I was the same. I was the same, right? So doing my makeup, things that brought me joy, picking out my outfits, just being creative, painting, those things were all medicine in ways that I didn't know.
Ellyn Schinke (41:01.767)
Frequency I've heard women say that hobbies. What are those?
Ellyn Schinke (41:08.79)
Yeah, facts.
Elyse (41:20.046)
The biggest thing that really empowered me to go through this and not go back to corporate and really move forward with launching my business and bringing myself out of that burnout was shifting one belief. And it goes back to what we said, and that is I can. Because when you believe you can, you will. When you believe you can't, you won't. It really is as simple as that. So if you can just shift one fundamental belief of if your brain, like let's say you want to launch a business like you and I both did, right? And your brain's like, I could never do that. Then question why.
Because that's, to me, that question, why do I believe I can't? Why do I think I can't do this? Why do I think I'm somebody who is in, that's impossible for me? Why gave me so much fuel to overcome my own excuses and my own shit, right? All those limiting beliefs that I didn't even realize were within me. When I started blasting through every single one of those, it was like breaking down brick walls. And I had built this self-imposed ceiling around me, and then all of a sudden I was free and I was limitless. And if I just believed that I could, whether it was getting up a mountain,
whether it was creating 10 minutes to meditate in the morning, whether it was actually being able to be a mom and have a kid and, you know, have a business and be there for both of my parents that are fighting stage four cancer and still be a present CEO. I didn't believe I could do those things until I learned how to believe, right? So then I started doing all those things. So if you can just shift that one belief to from, can't, to I can, your whole entire life will profoundly change.
Ellyn Schinke (42:34.83)
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. And if that seems like a astronomical leap to make for you right now, look for the evidence. Like, look for the evidence.
Elyse (42:42.658)
Yeah, yeah, or anytime when your brain says I can't, okay well what can I do in this moment? I can't go to the gym? Okay, can you stand up during one commercial break at TV and instead of fast-forwarding through it, because I know most of us are watching on DVR nowadays, right? instead of fast-forwarding through it, you get up and you do three minutes of movement. Can you do that? I'm sure you can. Can you do a one-minute meditation if you don't have ten minutes?
Ellyn Schinke (42:48.321)
Mm-hmm.
Ellyn Schinke (43:02.104)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Elyse (43:02.818)
It's all about what you can do. And I think we've gotten so good as women at building up these blockades and it's just safety. We're seeking safety, right? But we build up these blockades around us and then we don't live the life that we want, but it's because we believe that we can't. So what can you do about it? Can, if you want to take a bath, can you go take a 10 minute bath, right? If you want to go on an adventure, okay, maybe start with a day trip, right? If a solo adventure to Sri Lanka seems too crazy, then can you go an hour away to go do something you would love? Same, same.
Ellyn Schinke (43:10.412)
Yeah.
Ellyn Schinke (43:29.73)
love staycationing deuce deuce staycationing if you can't take these big like trips dude staycationing is the best because it is so logistically uncomplicated I actually staycation a lot more than I vacation nowadays so whatever works for you and honestly I'll throw it back to my stupid peel and stick tile analogy can I afford to buy a house where I can put the green tiles that I've always wanted as backslash my kitchen no
Elyse (43:32.41)
If you can't take these big trips, staycationing is the best because it is so logistically uncomplicated.
Ellyn Schinke (43:57.71)
can't afford that right now, but you know what I can do? I can take some of my birthday money, go buy green peel and stick tiles and put them up in my kitchen. That I can do. So it's like, find the way to make the micro step, as you said, forward toward what you want.
Elyse (44:06.126)
Yes. That I can do. Right.
Yeah
Ellyn Schinke (44:18.638)
Yeah, look for what I love that. I love that. Look for what you can do. Dude, I want to just keep talking to you for like another hour and a half. I'm like mad that I have a life the rest of the day. And I just want to chat with you and record 8000 more podcast episodes. But we can't do that because we're both CEOs. So in the meantime, where can people find more of this loveliness?
Elyse (44:21.614)
do.
Elyse (44:35.514)
So in the meantime, we're...
Elyse (44:43.242)
Yes, well come visit me inside of my podcast. It's called The Confidence Lounge. You can find it on whatever platform you love to listen to your podcasts. I release new episodes every single Monday. And visit me on my website. It's soulmakeup.com. I have a ton of free resources on there. So if you go to soulmakeup.com forward slash free resources, we will get you hooked up with all, yes, with all the career confidence building tips. And don't find me on Instagram, please, because I hate hanging out there. Instead, come visit me on LinkedIn. You can find me at Elise Conroy. I'm not an Instagram girlie. I'm all about business.
Ellyn Schinke (45:00.526)
I'll link it all below.
Ellyn Schinke (45:13.614)
getting I'm enjoying Instagram for posting random shit. I'm I need to I need to listen to my gut saying stop posting so much business shit. It's been telling me that there for a year and a half and I need to start to listen. I love Instagram. I love me some Instagram stories. I love sharing reels. But yeah, I'm starting to realize that's that's not my home anymore. Though I do not I have to say I'm not fully on board with LinkedIn yet that LinkedIn is cold DM city.
Elyse (45:17.656)
You're doing good. Yeah.
Elyse (45:28.336)
sharing reels.
Elyse (45:33.828)
Yeah.
Elyse (45:39.788)
Is it? I don't get any cold DMs. you got the wrong audience. You got to get them out of there. It's time to clean house.
Ellyn Schinke (45:40.258)
Holy shit, you, my God, I get so many cool DMs.
Ellyn Schinke (45:47.502)
I don't know how to do that. Okay. I'll, I'll navigate that later. I'll navigate that later. Cause yeah, I'm just like, why I don't want your sir. had somebody give me the, sorry, this is a tangent. I had somebody give me the pushiest cold DM on LinkedIn to like, said no. And they were like, why don't you want to work with me? Both like they pushed back when I said no. And I literally was just like, this is the pushiest sales encounter I have ever experienced in the entirety of having a business. I'm going to block you now. Have a nice life. yeah, anyways. So LinkedIn isn't always like that guys.
Elyse (45:49.05)
I'll show you.
Elyse (46:06.81)
sales encounter I've ever experienced in the entirety of having a business. I'm going to block you now. Have a nice life. my god. Anyway, so LinkedIn isn't always like that, But that's why I have time for it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for being the hot pink, sparkly, wonderful personality that you are. Thank you. I actually don't think you could have better branding.
Ellyn Schinke (46:17.422)
But that's why I haven't had great experiences. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for being the hot pink sparkly wonderful personality that you are. You I actually don't think you could have better branding than hot pink sparkles because I feel like that matches your personality as well. It's it is it's who you are. Like no matter like the only other do you have silver sparkle somewhere in your branding?
Elyse (46:35.709)
It's just me. It's who I am. Yeah.
Elyse (46:43.63)
I have gold. I have gold. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. yeah. I have literally have disco balls. Actually, they're silver disco balls in the shape of hearts right next to me over here on my other wall. Yep.
Ellyn Schinke (46:45.186)
works too. I was gonna say we need something like disco ball esque in your branding.
Ellyn Schinke (46:54.252)
I knew it. knew it. was like, that's another thing I feel like I would associate with you. But thank you so much for being here. Thank you for telling your story. Dude, I love it. I love it. So good. Thank you for being here with us. I appreciate you so much. And as always, guys, check out everything in the show notes. All the links are down below. And with that, stay relentless achievers and I will talk to you next time.
Elyse (47:05.731)
Thank you for having me.
